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 Post subject: [Deck Help Requested / Multiplayer] Tuvasa the Sunlit
AgePosted: 2018-Oct-10 11:24 am 

Joined: 2018-Oct-10 11:05 am
Age: Hatchling
I built a Tuvasa the Sunlit EDH deck for 4-player multiplayer, but I am having trouble devising a way to finish games. I'm not sure what direction I should take.

Strategy
The deck is mostly an enchantress deck, using non-Aura enchantments to draw cards. Unfortunately, I don't know how to finish games with this deck.

Deck Weakness
* Merciless Eviction
* Athreos, God of Passage EDH deck that has tons of sacrifice outlets that targets opponents to gradually force them to lose life while gaining life through Blood Artist effects. I also wonder if I need some kind of life gain in this deck.

Cards I Definitely Don't Want to Use or Can't Use
* Enchanted Evening / Aura Thief / Cleansing Meditation: The cards by themselves don't do very much and Enchanted Evening is expensive.
* Moat: Too expensive


Lands
37 lands

Mana Ramp/Filter/Reduction
Burgeoning
Courser of Kruphix
Exploration
Fertile Ground
Herald of the Pantheon
Kruphix, God of Horizons
Mirari’s Wake
Utopia Sprawl
Wild Growth
(I've thought about adding Mana Reflection or Zendikar Resurgent as well)


Tax/Restriction Effects
Aura of Silence
Energy Flux
Karmic Justice
Rest In Peace
Solemnity
Stony Silence


Pillowfort
Ghostly Prison
Propaganda
Sphere of Safety


Protection
Asceticism
Greater Auramancy
Leyline of Sanctity
Phyrexian Unlife
Privileged Position
Sterling Grove


Other Enchantments
Archetype of Imagination
Aura Shards (Not sure)
Clever Impersonator
Estrid’s Invocation
Leyline of Anticipation
Omniscience
Wheel of Sun and Moon


Finishers (?)
Ajani’s Chosen
Heliod, God of the Sun
Opalescence
Sigil of the Empty Throne
Starfield of Nyx
Yavimaya Enchantress


Card Draw/Filter
Argothian Enchantress
Eidolon of Blossoms
Enchantress’s Presence
Mesa Enchantress
Mystic Remora
Rhystic Study
Satyr Enchantress
Thassa, God of the Sea
Verduran Enchantress


Tutors
Enlightened Tutor
Idyllic Tutor


Removal
Austere Command
Beast Within
Final Judgement
Krosan Grip
Path to Exile
Supreme Verdict
Swords to Plowshares
Wrath of God


Counterspells (to stop Merciless Eviction)
Disdainful Stroke
Mystic Confluence (probably should be Counterspell)
Negate


Last edited by EnchanterShiroe on 2018-Oct-11 7:32 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: [Deck Help Requested / Multiplayer] Tuvasa the Sunlit
AgePosted: 2018-Oct-11 3:38 am 
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Joined: 2012-Dec-03 3:16 am
Age: Elder Dragon
I tried this as basically the precon, and I did not care for it. I say that because you should take anything I say with a grain of salt.

I think I would take out Wheel of Sun and Moon/Rest In Peace and put more ways to get enchantments back from the graveyard. Leyline of Anticipation also probably doesn't do enough in my opinion.

I was about to suggest Serra's Sanctum, but when did that become a $100+ card?

I think the Vows might be good additions, even though they are Auras they do alot to encourage people to attack others. Except Vow of Duty that is just a bad idea.

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The usual answer is "the social contract", but I guess that is not what you are looking for. Try house rules.


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 Post subject: Re: [Deck Help Requested / Multiplayer] Tuvasa the Sunlit
AgePosted: 2018-Oct-11 3:42 am 
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Joined: 2007-Mar-28 12:38 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Otaria
A few observations from someone with an Estrid deck:

With your pretty considerable amount of ramp, how often is Omniscience doing anything significant for you? By the time you get to 10 mana, all it seems like it is enabling is "one big turn" overkill- -chaining draws past the point where they're necessary. I can see how a Merciless Eviction would feel pretty backbreaking afterward.

Usually, the way I've seen enchantress decks win games is by a few choice Auras turning some throwaway creature into a credible threat. Rancor seems boring, but appropriate- -coming back to trigger Tuvasa each time the creature it's attached to dies. Bestow creatures similarly pull double duty.

Without going deep into Auras, you can play things like Luminarch Ascenscion, Leafdrake Roost, or other token-producing Enchantments. Or Planeswalkers- -those play nicely with your pillowforty cards. OG Garruk, in particular has synergy with your Enchant Lands, alongside making reasonably sized tokens.

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 Post subject: Re: [Deck Help Requested / Multiplayer] Tuvasa the Sunlit
AgePosted: 2018-Oct-11 3:54 am 

Joined: 2018-Oct-10 11:05 am
Age: Hatchling
Jayel,
Thanks for your input.

I will research more on auras and token production strategies and put away Omniscience.

inkeyes22, thanks for your input. If I bring back artifacts, I will probably have to take out Stony Silence and Energy Flux.


Last edited by EnchanterShiroe on 2018-Oct-11 6:21 am, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: [Deck Help Requested / Multiplayer] Tuvasa the Sunlit
AgePosted: 2018-Oct-11 4:51 am 
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Joined: 2011-Feb-07 3:37 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Danbury, CT
How committed are you to non-aura wins? My first thought was combat damage is a fine way for enchantresses to win, and if you're having trouble with a grindy BW opponent, a swift face-punching is the easiest way to take care of them.

Like Jeyal was saying, you don't need many (less than a half-dozen would be fine). The staples are Rancor, Shield of the Oversoul, Steel of the Godhead, and Eldrazi Conscription. You could also add Sovereigns of Lost Alara and Bruna, Light of Alabaster to get more mileage out of your auras. Finest Hour is another good combat finisher.

Last thought along these lines is that you might think about moving Tuvasa to the 99, and running Rafiq of the Many as your general (or if you like Tuvasa, run Rafiq in the 99... he's a pretty awesome pump card).

Jeyal wrote:
Or Planeswalkers- -those play nicely with your pillowforty cards. OG Garruk, in particular has synergy with your Enchant Lands, alongside making reasonably sized tokens.


This was my second thought. I'm kinda assuming you're playing with the pre-con here, and Estrid would be a good card to add in. If you want to go for the swarm-of-tokens finish (or just need more creatures to protect against sacrifice effects), Elspeth, Sun's Champion is pretty great.

You also don't list out your lands, but there's some really powerful utility lands in Bant colors.
Alchemists' Refuge (lets you drop Leyline of Anticipation)
Gavony Township
Vitu-ghazi, the City Tree
plus all the Ravnica bounce lands that you can get extra mileage out of untapping with Garruk or Estrid

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 Post subject: Re: [Deck Help Requested / Multiplayer] Tuvasa the Sunlit
AgePosted: 2018-Oct-11 5:12 am 

Joined: 2008-Nov-30 12:36 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
It is my humble opinion that the best finisher in a Tuvasa deck should be Tuvasa herself. I myself have a Tuvasa deck with Voltron being the main strategy, but the go-wide option built into the precon is still present and beefed up as well.

But so far, I've won nearly every game I have played with the deck with Tuvasa herself. And I think I only have maybe 10 voltron pieces total in the deck. However, you can easily get by with fewer than that if you go the Sovereigns of Lost Alara route. Then you probably want like 4 big things, maybe 5.

Eldrazi Conscription, the umbra one from the precon that turns your guy into an 8/8, and anything else you can find that gives your commander at least a +5/+5 or better boost.

And frankly the Enchanted Evening/Cleansing Meditation route is even better but I understand not wanting to do that out of both budget and social reasons, so to my thinking that just pushes you even harder toward needing to rely on Tuvasa General Damage kills a lot more.

I'd also consider Teferi's Protection if you have one - it protects you from not just Merciless Eviction but a whole shitload of other calamaties as well. But if you don't have it, then I'd run almost any other two- or three-mana counterspell over Mystic Confluence. this isn't a deck that wants to pass turn with 5 mana untapped very often at all.

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 Post subject: Re: [Deck Help Requested / Multiplayer] Tuvasa the Sunlit
AgePosted: 2018-Oct-11 6:01 am 

Joined: 2018-Oct-10 11:05 am
Age: Hatchling
Thanks for the help everyone.

I built this from the precon. I want to use Tuvasa as a commander over Rafiq, because I like her abilities. Most of my 37 lands are lands that provide color. I do not have many utility lands.

With all this feedback, I will rebuild this deck.

Does anyone here use Open the Vaults for their enchantment-based deck as a substitute for Replenish or should I not bother?


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 Post subject: Re: [Deck Help Requested / Multiplayer] Tuvasa the Sunlit
AgePosted: 2018-Oct-11 6:24 am 

Joined: 2008-Nov-30 12:36 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
EnchanterShiroe wrote:
Does anyone here use Open the Vaults for their enchantment-based deck as a substitute for Replenish or should I not bother?
I, myself, do not dare use Open the Vaults in my build because my playgroup currently has like three artifact decks and two other enchantment decks (thanks in no small part to those being two of the C18 themes!) running around.

I'd say it's totally a meta-call. If you think you're likely to get more value out of it (or are going to be able to just kill in one shot anyone who does profit too heavily), then I think Vaults is fine and would definitely consider it. I think either it or Replenish are pretty close to essential for the more voltron-y builds, as you WILL get X-for-1'ed. That's just something you have to plan for and can't really avoid completely.

There's also Retether, but you have to be pretty heavy on the aura plan to make it worthwhile. I also run a lot of removal auras like Song of the Dryads and Faith's Fetters, etc., so that bumps my Retether numbers up a bit, but I luckily have Replenish itself so I just run it, plus some slow recursion like Sun Titan and Hanna, Ship's Navigator.

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 Post subject: Re: [Deck Help Requested / Multiplayer] Tuvasa the Sunlit
AgePosted: 2018-Oct-11 7:05 am 
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Joined: 2012-Dec-03 3:16 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Second Sunrise is also a card that is often overlooked. It won't help with exile, but it is a huge blowout for that person that thought they were safe playing Austere Command.

_________________
"It does not do to leave a live dragon out of your calculations, if you live near him."
J. R. R. Tolkien

Shabbaman wrote:
The usual answer is "the social contract", but I guess that is not what you are looking for. Try house rules.


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 Post subject: Re: [Deck Help Requested / Multiplayer] Tuvasa the Sunlit
AgePosted: 2018-Oct-11 7:14 am 

Joined: 2008-Nov-30 12:36 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Inkeyes22 wrote:
Second Sunrise is also a card that is often overlooked. It won't help with exile, but it is a huge blowout for that person that thought they were safe playing Austere Command.

Oh, good call. Faith's Reward is basically that but for one mana more, you get to be the only one reaping the benefit, too. Though my comments on Mystic Confluence apply here as well - holding open four mana is going to be a tough sell at times.

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 Post subject: Re: [Deck Help Requested / Multiplayer] Tuvasa the Sunlit
AgePosted: 2018-Oct-11 8:04 am 
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Joined: 2011-Feb-07 3:37 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Danbury, CT
Sticking with Tuvasa is legit. The aura strategy works either way.

I have Replenish in my Rith, the Awakener enchantress deck, and I'm thinking about cutting it. The list is so good at drawing cards and producing mana that I don't need the big recursion, and frankly I'd rather run Rest in Peace.

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 Post subject: Re: [Deck Help Requested / Multiplayer] Tuvasa the Sunlit
AgePosted: 2018-Oct-11 12:01 pm 

Joined: 2018-Oct-10 11:05 am
Age: Hatchling
Looks like I need to pick up some of these auras. When did Steel of the Godhead and Shield of the Oversoul become $2 commons?! I thought I had these, but I might have trashed them a while back. :(

I do have Ancestral Mask, which seems appropriate in this deck.


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 Post subject: Re: [Deck Help Requested / Multiplayer] Tuvasa the Sunlit
AgePosted: 2018-Oct-12 12:40 am 

Joined: 2008-Nov-30 12:36 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
EnchanterShiroe wrote:
I do have Ancestral Mask, which seems appropriate in this deck.


It is - I cut it from my list SOLELY because it makes doing the "how big is Tuvasa" math harder.

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 Post subject: Re: [Deck Help Requested / Multiplayer] Tuvasa the Sunlit
AgePosted: 2018-Oct-12 1:18 am 

Joined: 2018-Oct-10 11:05 am
Age: Hatchling
thaumaturge wrote:
EnchanterShiroe wrote:
I do have Ancestral Mask, which seems appropriate in this deck.


It is - I cut it from my list SOLELY because it makes doing the "how big is Tuvasa" math harder.


Ok, I will keep it in my deck, because I want to see how big Tuvasa gets, especially if I want to defeat a player through Commander damage.


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 Post subject: Re: [Deck Help Requested / Multiplayer] Tuvasa the Sunlit
AgePosted: 2018-Oct-21 11:21 am 

Joined: 2018-Oct-10 11:05 am
Age: Hatchling
I rebuilt the deck as follows, using suggestions made by the posters.

Lands
37 lands


Mana Ramp/Filter/Reduction
Courser of Kruphix
Exploration
Herald of the Pantheon
Mana Reflection
Mirari’s Wake
Utopia Sprawl
Wild Growth


Tax/Restriction Effects
Aura of Silence
Karmic Justice
Rest In Peace
Stony Silence


Pillowfort
Ghostly Prison
Propaganda
Sphere of Safety


Protection
Asceticism
Greater Auramancy
Leyline of Sanctity
Privileged Position
Sterling Grove
Teferi's Protection


Aura Package
Ancestral Mask
Eldrazi Conscription
Ethereal Armor
Faith's Fetters (or Song of the Dryads or Angelic Destiny)
Rancor
Shield of the Oversoul
Spirit Mantle
Steel of the Godhead


Other Enchantments
Aura Shards
Clever Impersonator
Enchanted Evening
Estrid’s Invocation
True Conviction


Token Producers
Ajani’s Chosen
Heliod, God of the Sun
Sigil of the Empty Throne
Dawn of Hope


Card Draw/Filtering
Argothian Enchantress
Eidolon of Blossoms
Enchantress’s Presence
Mesa Enchantress
Rhystic Study
Satyr Enchantress
Thassa, God of the Sea
Verduran Enchantress


Tutors
Enlightened Tutor
Idyllic Tutor


Removal
Austere Command
Krosan Grip
Path to Exile
Supreme Verdict
Swords to Plowshares
Wrath of God


Counterspells
Counterspell
Negate


Other Creatures
Boon Satyr
Bruna, Light of Alabaster
Kestia, the Cultivator
Sun Titan
Yavimaya Enchantress


Other Spells
Retether


Planeswalker
Estrid, the Masked


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