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 Post subject: Commander 2017 (Tribal)
AgePosted: 2017-Apr-18 1:37 am 

Joined: 2008-Aug-08 6:34 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Rouen, France
So, early news on the Commander 2017 product.

Announcement:
http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/news/announcing-commander-2017-edition-2017-04-18

Important points:
4 (and not the usual 5) decks
56 new cards
Theme: Tribes!

Questions:
- Is it a traditional approach? If so, who's in and who's out? Not splitting by colours suggests a move to something different or, at least, making the zombie deck UB (or I guess UBW now), the elves GU, the Soldiers WB etc.
- Are wizards going to use this to push all those niche tribes / legends that players have been dying to see: Pirates, Warriors, Goats?
- What do you want to see?

_________________
Current decks:
Sydri's random pile of cards with "Artifact" on them
Scarab God Zombie Horde
Atraxa Superfriends
Yidris Eldrazi (4C Devoid)
Sissay Angel Oath
Wort's Goblin Conspiracy
Gonti's Mega-Bouncy Castle


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 Post subject: Re: Commander 2017 (Tribal)
AgePosted: 2017-Apr-18 2:28 am 
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Joined: 2012-Dec-03 3:16 am
Age: Elder Dragon
With only Allied colored pair's left we knew they would have to change up the pattern soon... But only 4 decks?

It seems we are still getting the same number of new cards just not as many sweet reprints. Not sure how I feel about that. I guess I have enough Evolving Wilds for a bit.

_________________
"It does not do to leave a live dragon out of your calculations, if you live near him."
J. R. R. Tolkien

Shabbaman wrote:
The usual answer is "the social contract", but I guess that is not what you are looking for. Try house rules.


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 Post subject: Re: Commander 2017 (Tribal)
AgePosted: 2017-Apr-18 2:31 am 
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Joined: 2012-Jan-06 10:25 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Seattle
C'mon UR Thopter tribal!

_________________
Glissa, the Traitor -> Voltron
Mayael the Anima -> Flopping Fatties
Phenax, God of Deception -> Grave Rats
Starke of Rath -> Wrath of Starke: MRC

Proving Grounds: Drawmia-maro, Titania When Lands Attack, Tromokratis Read it Again, Kaalia's Klerics, Hordes of Tribes.


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 Post subject: Re: Commander 2017 (Tribal)
AgePosted: 2017-Apr-18 2:58 am 

Joined: 2015-Mar-04 12:43 am
Age: Drake
It seems like a great opportunity to provide support to a couple of tribes that already have substantial numbers but need more lords and enhancers (clerics, knights, snakes, ...).

Otherwise, looking at characteristic and iconic races, I think Goblins and/or Zombies are very likely. Elves less so because Freyalise's deck from 2014 already featured a strong tribal theme.

Personally, I would love to see Angels.


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 Post subject: Re: Commander 2017 (Tribal)
AgePosted: 2017-Apr-18 3:32 am 
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Joined: 2012-Jan-06 10:25 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Seattle
The safe route would probably be Angels, Demons, Dragons, Snakes/spiders/hydras? Something green but Elves.


I'd like to see some more Archer support. Greatbow Doyan should be legendary.

_________________
Glissa, the Traitor -> Voltron
Mayael the Anima -> Flopping Fatties
Phenax, God of Deception -> Grave Rats
Starke of Rath -> Wrath of Starke: MRC

Proving Grounds: Drawmia-maro, Titania When Lands Attack, Tromokratis Read it Again, Kaalia's Klerics, Hordes of Tribes.


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 Post subject: Re: Commander 2017 (Tribal)
AgePosted: 2017-Apr-18 3:35 am 
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Joined: 2012-Dec-25 1:37 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Looking at the tribes featured in EDHREC, I would expect dragons to make a comeback. Wizards have stated several times they are the most popular creature type of all, not to mention they fit perfectly into the thematic of the format (it's called Elder Dragon Highlander after all). And, speaking from personal experience and as a fan of dragons, the two most popular dragon commanders aren't actually that awesome as dragon commanders. Karrthus, Tyrant of Jund is so powerful that you don't even need other dragons in your deck, he will easily three-shot players at the table when given the chance. It's second ability is also a social nightmare: it creates feels-bad moments for other players with dragon commanders and interacts with clones very poorly (nobody likes to have all his dragons stolen for just four mana). Scion of the Ur-Dragon became awesome when Tarkir was released, thanks to all the dragons being distributed in all five colors. Sadly, its ability leads too easily to combo, and even when your deck is not build for that, people will still attack you out of fear. So, personally, I would love to see a new legendary dragon tribal commander emerge in the new product.

My second guess would go for angels. There are very popular in Commander, but have very few cards that support their tribe. A new legendary angel, preferably RW or RWB, would leave many fans happy.

My third guess would go for werewolves. After the fiasco that was Ulrich, this product would be the perfect opportunity to make werewolves a viable tribe for Commander. Let's just hope they don't screw everything up again...

Besides these three, my guess is as good as any other's. But knowing they always put two new commanders in each product, I think each deck will feature more than one tribe, maybe smaller and more popular tribes such as goblins and/or elves. Overall, depending what tribes they choose and what cards they will print that support them, this could either be a pretty awesome product or a huge failure of opportunity for them.

_________________
Name: Forged in Stone
General: Nahiri, the Lithomancer
Archetype: Aggro

Name: Night of the Ninja
General: Vela the Night-Clad
Archetype: Aggro-Control

Name: Boros Legion
General: Aurelia, the Warleader
Archetype: Aggro

Name: Dragon Fire
General: Karrthus, Tyrant of Jund
Archetype: Midrange


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 Post subject: Re: Commander 2017 (Tribal)
AgePosted: 2017-Apr-18 3:49 am 
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Joined: 2017-Mar-11 6:43 am
Age: Dragon
This is going to be a case of hopes vs. reality

Hope:
Leviathans vs. Golems vs. Orcs vs. Elementals

Reality:
Goblins vs. Elves vs. Merfolk vs. Zombies, probably

Hope:
Cavern of Souls reprint in every box

Reality:
Crappier EDH-specific variant is more likely

Hope:
New ways to use obscure subtypes

Reality:
A copy of Coat of Arms or Obelisk of Urd in each box, probably.

_________________
niheloim wrote:
Wall of Chat. 2U
Creature- Wall

Defender
Wall of chat exceeds at using a lot of words to mischaracterize opposing view points.

Warp Riders (Ephara Solar Flare)


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 Post subject: Re: Commander 2017 (Tribal)
AgePosted: 2017-Apr-18 4:21 am 
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Joined: 2010-Dec-10 12:16 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
If they were smart they would have themes for both races and classes (such as having a WX deck and a BX deck, and have Clerics in both of those decks) allowing for up to 8 tribal themes to get at least some support.

If they were smart, they would make sure to focus on moderate support tribes or those that are not unified (such as Cats having significant presence in RGW, but not supported across those colors and legends only in mono G, Mono W and WU).

If they were smart, many of the new cards would be "choose a creature type" templates, so there will be uses beyond the tribes featured in the decks.

Unfortunately, probably this:

Mr Degradation wrote:
Reality:
Goblins vs. Elves vs. Merfolk vs. Zombies, probably
Crappier EDH-specific variant is more likely
A copy of Coat of Arms or Obelisk of Urd in each box, probably.

_________________
V/R

HK

Hazezon Tamar - Manland theme
Seshiro the Anointed - Snake Tribal
Jedit Ojanen of Efrava - Cat and Warrior Dual Tribal
Doran, the Seige Tower - Wall Tribal
Progenitus - Hydra themed Proliferate Deck
Karona, the False God - Backstabbing Hug


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 Post subject: Re: Commander 2017 (Tribal)
AgePosted: 2017-Apr-18 5:00 am 
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Joined: 2012-Feb-07 4:15 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
I'm actually hoping against dragons a bit. There are actually plenty of other Dragon lords that are around, such as Bladewing the Risen and the Fate Reforged cycle (although Atarka and Kolaghan are the only ones actually worth playing), and a lot of other non-lords like Intet or Rith, the Awakener are still pretty good for dragon tribal.

Werewolves I would definitely also be heavily in favor of, for obvious reasons. Although I still think Ruric Thar is everything we'd want in a werewolf general so I wouldn't be too disappointed otherwise.

Ultimately, I think what I'd want would be RG werewolves, WB clerics, GW cats, and UB pirates.

_________________
Current Generals:
III Omnath, Locus of Mana III Thada Adel, Acquisitor III Geth, Lord of the Vault III Eight-and-a-Half-Tails III Zo-Zu the Punisher III BruseIkra III Kynaios and Tiro of Meletis III Kess, Dissident Mage, III AkriSilas III Grenzo, Havoc Raiser III Ghalta, Primal Hunger III Ambassador Laquatus III Anax and Cymede III Sidisi, Brood Tyrant III Shu Yun, the Silent Tempest III Ghave, Guru of Spores III Zurgo Helmsmasher III Yidris, Maelstrom Wielder III


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 Post subject: Re: Commander 2017 (Tribal)
AgePosted: 2017-Apr-18 6:35 am 
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Joined: 2010-Dec-10 12:16 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Uktabi_Kong wrote:
Ultimately, I think what I'd want would be RG werewolves, WB clerics, GW cats, and UB pirates.


If werewolves were on the table (not convinced due to DFC ism) I would prefer RGX (W or U, probably W since the mechanic needs some help in managing the spells per turn). Ideally it could be a "wolf or werewolf" effect.

In my happy "Magic"al Christmas land, the decks would be four of the following:

RGW Cats
WUB Spirit
BRG Ooze
BX Skeleton (maybe G or U, if not GUB)
RX Viashino
WB Cleric
UR(w) Artificer
RG(U) Mutant

Maybe some of the new creatures will be used to fill in tribes that have a decent General but not enough members (Gorgon, Barbarian, Advisor, etc)

_________________
V/R

HK

Hazezon Tamar - Manland theme
Seshiro the Anointed - Snake Tribal
Jedit Ojanen of Efrava - Cat and Warrior Dual Tribal
Doran, the Seige Tower - Wall Tribal
Progenitus - Hydra themed Proliferate Deck
Karona, the False God - Backstabbing Hug


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 Post subject: Re: Commander 2017 (Tribal)
AgePosted: 2017-Apr-18 7:38 am 
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Joined: 2012-Dec-03 3:16 am
Age: Elder Dragon
The only reason I can think of why they are doing 4 decks instead of the usual 5 is that they are doing 2 races and 2 classes.

So in the interest of wild speculations this is what I would like to see: U/r Artificer, W/b Knights, R/g Dragons, W/g/r Cats or Werewolves (doubt werewolves just due to dfc).

_________________
"It does not do to leave a live dragon out of your calculations, if you live near him."
J. R. R. Tolkien

Shabbaman wrote:
The usual answer is "the social contract", but I guess that is not what you are looking for. Try house rules.


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 Post subject: Re: Commander 2017 (Tribal)
AgePosted: 2017-Apr-18 7:44 am 
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Joined: 2010-Jul-18 9:59 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
What I want to see: Ooze (Black/Red/Green), Beast (Green/Red), Warrior (Black/Red/Green), Illusion (Blue/White)

What I expect to see: Dragons, Clerics, Demons, Soldiers

_________________
"Degenerate, unfun decks generally come from degenerate, unfun players in my experience." - Cthulus Thrall

"- if this spell is played ten times in a given game then I suggest you warm up the tar and pluck some chickens" - tarnar

"I'm happy to serve as a quote machine" - Sheldon


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 Post subject: Re: Commander 2017 (Tribal)
AgePosted: 2017-Apr-18 8:14 am 
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Joined: 2014-Jul-28 8:30 am
Age: Dragon
Rebels would be fun. Those buggers are long overdue for some love.

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specter404 wrote:
Basically, when it comes to commander, I want you to stab me through the heart, not cut off my balls.

Gath Immortal wrote:
Twenty Kavus and a Dream is not a legacy deck.


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 Post subject: Re: Commander 2017 (Tribal)
AgePosted: 2017-Apr-18 8:25 am 
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Joined: 2007-Mar-28 12:38 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Otaria
I'm hoping for "20 Kavus and a Dream," now.

Prediction: Some sort of "race/class" option is going to be in each box. Say, a deck full of Elf Warriors with Elf synergies and Warrior synergies. With a different general depending on which you'd like to emphasize.

Hopeful tribal support: (Some combination of) Ninja, Assassin, Rebel, Cleric, Monk, Faerie, Golem
Expected tribal support: (Some combination of) Elf, Goblin, Merfolk, Zombie, Human, Dragon, Warrior, Soldier, Shaman, Wizard, Artificer

_________________
Current Deckbuilding Project:

An EDH deck for each Orzhov-colored commander with no card overlap (save basic land).
Selenia, Dark Angel
Tesya, Orzhov Scion
Ghost Council of Orzhova
Vish Kal, Blood Arbiter
Athreos, God of Passage
Triad of Fates
Obzedat, Ghost Council
Teysa, Envoy of Ghosts

Daxos the Returned
Karlov of the Ghost Council
Ayli, Eternal Pilgrim
Kambal, Consul of Allocation

Ravos, Soultender
Tymna the Weaver

Also,Saskia the Unyielding


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 Post subject: Re: Commander 2017 (Tribal)
AgePosted: 2017-Apr-18 9:03 am 

Joined: 2012-Jun-07 5:38 pm
Age: Drake
I've been on this forum and on various Facebook posts and there's plenty of speculation, including ridiculous suggestions/hopes of the random few (for things such as Camels, Homunculus, and others) which I feel are known to be unrealistic, and those that are the token tribes that are most likely to fit in for their notoriety (elves, goblins, zombies, etc.)

The article specifically said most "popular" and "interesting" tribes...

While I'm normally all for a tribe that's either lacking support or is one of the up and coming (like say, Minotaurs) This is what I've concluded for various reasons:

Unlikely Picks:
Elves, Goblins, Merfolk - unlikely - super played out/boring, would be the easy button for WOTC, regardless of color combinations used.
Zombies - should be an impossible choice. They just got a new lord, lord enchantment that spits out tokens, and another zombie themed Planeswalker, plus other good tribal cards - super played out (now has more lord effects than any other tribe.....) Primarily going to be in mono-black or U/B.
Kithkin, Viashino, Ooze, Goat, Homunculus, etc. - This is the "pipe dream/magical-christmas-land" of options. They're not popular enough (likely never will be), heavily under supported or hasn't been relevant in years.
Dragons - Plenty of dragon support recently with KTK block, doesn't seem likely, but is among the most popular and has it's pick of color options as long as it includes Red.
Human - mostly stale at this point given the over abundance of it from BFZ block, but possible. Given the past 3-4 Duel Decks, there have been human decks released as product. Mostly in W/G as of late.
Werewolves - botched attempt to make a legendary, tribe has support, but the mechanics don't really lend themselves to powerful/exciting plays. Tribe is popular, but underpowered and too easy to play around. forces R/G
Allies - we just had them in BFZ, they're cheap enough to procure, they're broken with combo pieces, mediocre on their own. Unlikely to be enough value in a deck to warrant purchasing unless WOTC decides to throw in chase rares in the decklist. Otherwise 5 colors gives options.

Likely Picks:
Slivers - popular tribe, excuse to reprint Sliver Legion, unlikely to see story presence, lack of a core set makes supplemental product like this the perfect spot for them. More options for 5 colors.
Vampires - popular tribe, could fit into a variety of color pairings so it gives them more room to play with.
Angel/Demon - some of the most popular types despite little if any "lord" support, usually heavy costed, but popular.
Knights/Soldiers - Knights are semi-popular, often associated with Humans. Soldiers haven't gotten love in a while but are a very large tribe in the game and thus a popular one. However currently they're stuck in Mono-white for the most part.
Clerics/Spirit - recently have been getting more support, prevalent through the game. Mostly going to be W/x options.
Warrior - very popular tribe with KTK block, fits multiple color pairings.

For what it's worth, I'd love some Ninja/Samurai/Warrior/Soldier/Sliver cards, but some are more likely than others :/


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