Login | Register


All times are UTC - 7 hours


It is currently 2019-Dec-06 9:47 pm




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 350 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7 ... 24  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: Oath of the Gatewatch -- The Colorless Basic Land is Here!
AgePosted: 2015-Nov-18 7:53 am 
EDH Rules Committee

Joined: 2006-May-18 5:21 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Willbender wrote:
  • All old cards are changed to use ◊s instead of {number} in mana generation in future printings. (For example, Sol Ring's text box becomes "{T}: Add ◊◊ to your mana pool.")


Wouldn't it just be easier to say "Adding ◊ to your mana pool is the same as adding 1"? And "◊ in a mana cost may only be paid by colorless mana"


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Oath of the Gatewatch -- The Colorless Basic Land is Here!
AgePosted: 2015-Nov-18 8:02 am 

Joined: 2014-Jul-26 11:35 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Wilkinsbane wrote:
Interesting, it does seem like a new spin on snow mana.

I am not looking forward to opening Wastes instead of any other full-art basic land though, assuming Oath will have them.


Why? If they are only printed in a small set, which seems probable, then they will be worth a mint.

_________________
Favourite Deck:
Ghost Council of Orzhova

Playing Online:
Noyan Darr & Sedris Zombie Guy


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Oath of the Gatewatch -- The Colorless Basic Land is Here!
AgePosted: 2015-Nov-18 8:02 am 

Joined: 2011-Aug-18 3:35 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
papa_funk wrote:
Willbender wrote:
  • All old cards are changed to use ◊s instead of {number} in mana generation in future printings. (For example, Sol Ring's text box becomes "{T}: Add ◊◊ to your mana pool.")


Wouldn't it just be easier to say "Adding ◊ to your mana pool is the same as adding 1"? And "◊ in a mana cost may only be paid by colorless mana"


No, we need to retemplate 10,000 cards. 3 is clearly more complicated than ◊◊◊.


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Oath of the Gatewatch -- The Colorless Basic Land is Here!
AgePosted: 2015-Nov-18 8:10 am 

Joined: 2009-Oct-08 1:00 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Wilkinsbane wrote:
I am not looking forward to opening Wastes instead of any other full-art basic land though, assuming Oath will have them.

Fair, although foil full-art Wastes are gonna be worth bank.

papa_funk wrote:
Wouldn't it just be easier to say "Adding ◊ to your mana pool is the same as adding 1"? And "◊ in a mana cost may only be paid by colorless mana"

Based on the rules for other weird mana symbols, I would say this is exactly how it will work. (For example, the rules for Phyrexian mana basically say "You can pay this with either {G} or 2 life. Adding this to your mana pool is the same as adding {G}.")


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Oath of the Gatewatch -- The Colorless Basic Land is Here!
AgePosted: 2015-Nov-18 8:11 am 
User avatar

Joined: 2012-Sep-19 1:30 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
papa_funk wrote:
Willbender wrote:
  • All old cards are changed to use ◊s instead of {number} in mana generation in future printings. (For example, Sol Ring's text box becomes "{T}: Add ◊◊ to your mana pool.")
Wouldn't it just be easier to say "Adding ◊ to your mana pool is the same as adding 1"? And "◊ in a mana cost may only be paid by colorless mana"
Effectively the same thing. I'm just positing that they're going to make this the new standard template for all colorless mana production going forward.

_________________
Useful threads: Colorless CI landsGraveyard HateRoR's Greatest Hits
My Decks: Zombiepocalypse (Thraximundar) ♦ Thrun stands alone (voltron) ♦ Ashling the Burninator ♦ Doran beatdown (treefolk/plant tribal) ♦ Mine! (UB theft/clone) ♦ Vampire Beatdown (Edgar Markov) ♦ BW Enchantments (Daxos the Returned)


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Oath of the Gatewatch -- The Colorless Basic Land is Here!
AgePosted: 2015-Nov-18 8:19 am 

Joined: 2011-Aug-18 3:35 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
charlequin wrote:
Based on the rules for other weird mana symbols, I would say this is exactly how it will work. (For example, the rules for Phyrexian mana basically say "You can pay this with either {G} or 2 life. Adding this to your mana pool is the same as adding {G}.")


You can't add Phyrexian mana to your pool. It's a hybrid payment but you pay with normal W or two life.


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Oath of the Gatewatch -- The Colorless Basic Land is Here!
AgePosted: 2015-Nov-18 8:21 am 

Joined: 2013-Aug-20 4:37 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Boston
papa_funk wrote:
Wouldn't it just be easier to say "Adding ◊ to your mana pool is the same as adding 1"? And "◊ in a mana cost may only be paid by colorless mana"

The only question is whether that is better down the road than having a future new player look back on a card like Mirrorpool and not know what the heck is going on with the diamonds. I doubt that a massive Oracle update will occur, but I don't think it is outside the realm of possibility.

specter404 wrote:
Why? If they are only printed in a small set, which seems probable, then they will be worth a mint.

(This is all based on the assumption that ◊ is effectively the same as {1} on the lands.) They'll probably be worth something while they're in standard, but I'm going to be shocked if they are more than a quarter after they rotate. Outside of dodging nonbasic hate, they really don't do anything that isn't covered a million times by all of the "T: Add {1}" nonbasics. It will be useful to have 10 or so for colorless EDH decks, but in a deck with color there is use for maybe 1 copy if you want to use Solemn Simulacrum to get the mana for your Mirrorpool.


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Oath of the Gatewatch -- The Colorless Basic Land is Here!
AgePosted: 2015-Nov-18 8:22 am 

Joined: 2009-Oct-08 1:00 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Epsilon wrote:
You can't add Phyrexian mana to your pool. It's a hybrid payment but you pay with normal W or two life.

You can't have a Phyrexian mana in your pool because "a Phyrexian mana" isn't a thing. You can add any type of mana that exists in a card's mana cost to your mana pool, because Elemental Resonance exists:

Image

Thus, every type of mana that appears in a card's mana cost (including Phyrexian mana) has a rule describing what happens if you add that symbol to your pool.


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Oath of the Gatewatch -- The Colorless Basic Land is Here!
AgePosted: 2015-Nov-18 8:53 am 

Joined: 2011-Aug-18 3:35 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
charlequin wrote:
Epsilon wrote:
You can't add Phyrexian mana to your pool. It's a hybrid payment but you pay with normal W or two life.

You can't have a Phyrexian mana in your pool because "a Phyrexian mana" isn't a thing. You can add any type of mana that exists in a card's mana cost to your mana pool, because Elemental Resonance exists:

Image

Thus, every type of mana that appears in a card's mana cost (including Phyrexian mana) has a rule describing what happens if you add that symbol to your pool.



I'm not sure what point you're trying to make there since you admit it doesn't exist... The resonance explains how to handle phyrexian mana on the card already and you certainly don't "add" it to your mana pool, you choose which side of the hybrid you want which in this case is only the default color since 2 life isn't mana.

◊ mana (actual mana) is not at all like Phyrexian mana (a hybrid symbol) so any comparisons to it are irrelevant. ◊ can be added to your pool and it is different from colorless in some way or it would just say add 1 to your pool not add ◊.


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Oath of the Gatewatch -- The Colorless Basic Land is Here!
AgePosted: 2015-Nov-18 9:30 am 
User avatar

Joined: 2012-Sep-19 1:30 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Epsilon wrote:
◊ can be added to your pool and it is different from colorless in some way or it would just say add 1 to your pool not add ◊.
...unless "add ◊" is the new way of saying "add {1}".

_________________
Useful threads: Colorless CI landsGraveyard HateRoR's Greatest Hits
My Decks: Zombiepocalypse (Thraximundar) ♦ Thrun stands alone (voltron) ♦ Ashling the Burninator ♦ Doran beatdown (treefolk/plant tribal) ♦ Mine! (UB theft/clone) ♦ Vampire Beatdown (Edgar Markov) ♦ BW Enchantments (Daxos the Returned)


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Oath of the Gatewatch -- The Colorless Basic Land is Here!
AgePosted: 2015-Nov-18 9:57 am 
User avatar

Joined: 2013-Oct-26 9:21 am
Age: Dragon
Location: Xenia, OH, USA
Willbender wrote:
Epsilon wrote:
◊ can be added to your pool and it is different from colorless in some way or it would just say add 1 to your pool not add ◊.
...unless "add ◊" is the new way of saying "add {1}".


Again, and I know I keep saying it, I think this is true. It's just to make it easier to distinguish between "colorless" and "generic" which can be a sticking point (albeit a very small, easily overcome one) for new players. Plus it allows for "must be paid with colorless mana" in casting/activation costs. And avoid getting certain colorless things for free, as it would make cost reductions only apply to generic mana, as opposed to colorless as well.

_________________
You know you've said something right when Sheldon hits you with a QFT...

http://mtgcommander.net/Forum/viewtopic.php?p=233412#p233412


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Oath of the Gatewatch -- The Colorless Basic Land is Here!
AgePosted: 2015-Nov-18 12:43 pm 

Joined: 2009-Oct-08 1:00 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Epsilon wrote:
I'm not sure what point you're trying to make there since you admit it doesn't exist...

That you can perform the action "add {mana symbol X} to your mana pool" even if X doesn't represent a specific type of mana. It's exactly the same principle on which {1} adds colorless mana now -- the symbol just means different things in costs vs. generation, as defined by the rules.


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Oath of the Gatewatch -- The Colorless Basic Land is Here!
AgePosted: 2015-Nov-19 1:42 am 

Joined: 2011-Sep-30 6:08 am
Age: Elder Dragon
The more I think about this, the less the spoiled cards seem real. If that really is the Colorless symbol, R&D showed a really uncharacteristic lack of foresight by not putting it onto BFZ cards. We already had a batch of new stuff related to Colorless, and they very easily could have put it onto cards like Channeller to give the block an more consistent look and feel.

_________________
Spectrar Ghost wrote:
Cryocerete (sp?)


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Oath of the Gatewatch -- The Colorless Basic Land is Here!
AgePosted: 2015-Nov-19 1:45 am 
User avatar

Joined: 2012-Jan-06 10:25 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Seattle
Perhaps it will be something like phyrexian mana and it will have an alternate cost.

Kozilek costs 8<><>. You can pay <> with either 1 <> mana or 2 colorless.

_________________
Glissa, the Traitor -> Voltron
Mayael the Anima -> Flopping Fatties
Phenax, God of Deception -> Grave Rats
Starke of Rath -> Wrath of Starke: MRC

Proving Grounds: Drawmia-maro, Titania When Lands Attack, Tromokratis Read it Again, Kaalia's Klerics, Hordes of Tribes.


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Oath of the Gatewatch -- The Colorless Basic Land is Here!
AgePosted: 2015-Nov-19 2:13 am 

Joined: 2009-Oct-08 1:00 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
crokaycete wrote:
The more I think about this, the less the spoiled cards seem real.

They're perfectly formatted and templated, they feature new art that couldn't possibly be from some random source due to how specific it is to the setting, and they've been confirmed by historically accurate sources on MTGS. They're definitely real.


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 350 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7 ... 24  Next

All times are UTC - 7 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 72 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron